Redshift node to split out channels for texture based PBR?

[Greg_R]

Hi,

I've found that baking out channels into textures via custom AOVs is super useful for making PBR textures, and can speed up renders a fair amount while retaining a good quality. From time to time, I receive materials with super complex shader networks, that then use material blenders before going to the surface. My question: Is there a Redshift node that would allow me to output various channels (Diffuse color, diffuse weight, reflection color, reflection roughness, reflection weight, etc) to put into a Custom AOV node and bake to texture images AFTER the Material Blender node, just before going into the Surface input? Sure would be helpful!

Basically, I just want to catch the channels that I could use to make a simple PBR material based on baked texture images. Is this doable?

Bonus points (separate question, I guess): Is it possible to bake stacked Redshift materials into one texture based PBR material?

Thanks,

• Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

I suggest this one given that I understand your idea correctly:
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2024/en-us/Default.htm#../Subsystems/Default/Content/html/Store_Information_To_AOV.html
I get limitations here for shaders, Hence the suggestions below.

Layering materials allows for many combinations, and I'm unable to explore all combinations based on a general question. Layering might influence the next layer, etc., in short, if such an idea would work with all combinations.
I answer here (as far as possible), not from memory nor apply the "I think that should work" mentality. I try things first. As you can see below:

I hope that works already; if not, here is some DIY stuff.

I can build my "bakery" with "Integer UserData" and Shader Switch, while the Frame number drives the ID. in the example below., which shows three set-ups.
CV4_2024_drs_24_RSai_01.c4d

If the Store Color to AOV is not working, an emission channel might work better in this DIY-Bakery, depending on the channels you like to bake.

This means you bake the results in any number, while greater than 10 needs the tips from the manual:
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2024/en-us/Default.htm#REDSHIFT/html/Shader+Switch.html

If you have requests or suggestions that are neither in the manual nor any tutorials, please use the "Share Your Idea" here:
https://www.maxon.net/en/support-center

I would encourage you to check if there is an idea or solution in the Redshift 3D forum
https://redshift.maxon.net/category/10/general-discussion

All the best

[Greg_R]

Hi Dr. Sassi,
Thanks for the quick response. Unfortunately your first link isn't working for me. I end up at a 404 error page.

I'm baking anything that comes into the material from a network w/ settings that need to be calculated. And I have materials that are blended before being passed along to the Surface output node. I'm doing the baking twice (once for each pre-blended material) , replacing any networks with the baked texture images, and then merging the two partially baked materials into the Material Blender.

I made a few screenshots to illustrate what I'm trying to do, but apparently the dimensions are too big. Is there anywhere I can upload them besides this text box?

Thanks,

• Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Sorry about the link; I get a #404 now as well.

Something has changed. Please try again
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2024/en-us/Default.htm#../Subsystems/Default/Content/html/Store_Information_To_AOV.html

One question comes to mind: When you blend textures, is that a process you can do in Photoshop?

Yes, the image limitation here is 500 pixels high. Perhaps Dropbox, Google, Adobe, Apple, or Wetransfer can help. I have no access to Instagram anymore (I deleted my account since I do not offer my images for AI and see my content later on in perhaps questionable context. So Imgure seems to be the only one besides the cloud services mentioned. For security reasons, that is my only selection.

Please be aware that Blend modes have different results based on Color Space if you move to Photoshop and have a different Color Conversion Engine running.

All the best

[Greg_R]

Hi Dr. Sassi,
Yeah, I guess Photoshop could be a way to do it. I'll give that a try. Thanks!

I put my screenshots in a Dropbox folder here: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/jjibiu7y0e1nrqry1vfux/AC1X2nHA88gtkg2P1t-NRJQ?rlkey=dc7jnarunqx4lxhxfxcr6fr44&st=w7823bzv&dl=0

bake01 and bake02 are the way I'm working now. Then I put my proposed "Material channel splitter" node, which I'm guessing doesn't exist. Honestly, if it ever COULD exist, I think this would be invaluable for people who are making assets for games, AR or VR. One of the things I've struggled with most is properly baking texture images to work with, say, Unreal Engine, and I feel like I'm not the only one.

Thanks again for your time!
-Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the examples.

Please suggest what you need here:

https://www.maxon.net/en/support-center

"Share Your Ideas"

Here, we can look into it and perhaps refine your input. Please note this forum is not a replacement for the "Share Your Ideas"< I will support anything that makes anyone's work more accessible and better.
.

The number of channels used for Game Materials is typically as small as possible, yet many inputs are possible, and, going by Unreal's Substrate idea, we might see changes in the way materials are defined. Not to start a discussion about Unreal here, not the place, but you mentioned Game Engines, and yes, I'm sure every good idea submitted is welcomed.

The main question that I imagine will come up is why not set materials up so they can produce the wanted data directly. This would be more future-proof, as the separation of information would be integrated from the start.
Of course, I'm not able to check a few hundred materials, if that is always an option, so this is more of a question for you to explore.

When you want to blend the weight, why not set it up as a Node before the Standard Material, then Blend this Node value (single parameter or texture) and feed it into the Layer option for the Custome AOV feed?

The single values can be used in the specific Standard materials anyway; they do not need to be set up inside.

With this, retrieving the data is no longer a challenge; you have it already.

Besides this, blending the data separately allows for an independent change per channel.

Again, the Multi-Standard Material/Material Blend can be used as before. The Blend Color stands as an example for all channels in use, so it can be taken directly to be Stored as AOV.

.

I have created a simple setup to demo it. It needs to be seen at render time.
CV4_2024_drs_24_RSsc_01.c4d

I would like to stress that this is a suggestion and not something that I have used in any production, so please test this carefully. I hope it helps you get your data as you would like it.

All the best