Voronoi Fracture Planes to Follow Normals

[GregBollella]

[LampShadeForCV.c4d.zip](Request Entity Too Large) I'd like the fracture planes to all be parallel to the surface normals near the fracture. Currently, it almost works but some of the fractures angle off. Ultimately, I want to create a inversion of the original fracture to be the 'lead' between pieces of glass in a Tiffany lamp.

Here's a link to a c4d file that will explain much better. You can see in the inversion some of the fracture planes are at steep angles to the surface normals.

Thanks,
Greg

https://www.icloud.com/iclouddrive/094a3ZVuI3jFwiJIFtVEVvoEQ#ForCV-07Feb23

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Would you mind checking the file of your URL? It feels like the project we discussed a month ago.

Cheers

[GregBollella]

Sorry, lots going on here and I grabbed the wrong file.

Here is the proper link: https://www.icloud.com/iclouddrive/08c5WVgEhMvDeeALjwNDPl-xQ#LampShadeForCV

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Thanks for using iCloud and the file!

Please have a look at the file below.

Is this Frame close to where you want to have it? I have animated the glass parts so you can see the frame with and without.

Cheers

CV4_2023_drs_23_MGvf_01.c4d

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Thanks Dr. Sassi!

Not quite. Since you started with a sphere (and only a single surface) the -6cm transform in the y-axis doesn't give the look I need, which is that the glass pieces on the upper part of the shade are elongated and meet at a point. Given a hemisphere with a single surface I can, through inversion, extrusions, volume builder/mesher, and filters get a very nice result, except that the pattern isn't what I need. If I use a hemisphere with an inner surface (0.2cm thick) the pattern is correct but the angles of the fracture planes is not parallel to the surface normals which results in 'lead' that is too wide and 'glass' that looks odd.

So, my next question, how can one -semi-manually place the points on a surface to give to the V. Frac. object? I see the 'Sources' input in the V. Frac. and have tried various combinations of the distribution and also the shader options but nothing, afaik, produces a pleasing distribution.

Can I use any sort of texture map or Matrix with fields to get the points as I want?

Thanks,
Greg

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Here is where I ended up.

I discovered that any object that has points can be used as a source. I created a hemisphere slightly smaller than the shade, cloned a helix of a zero'd out helix (thus just two points in the same exact 3-space position) onto it, and used it as the source. I used Push Apart and Plain effectors with a Cylinder Field to get the pattern I needed.

The V. Frac. was on a single-sided sphere and with the point distribution as above things looked good. So after a Current-State-To-Object on the pieces and inversion I extruded them. For the 'lead' I used a Volume Builder and a Mesher with smoothing to puff up the 'lead'

Here is the resulting file:
https://www.icloud.com/iclouddrive/0ccDQkdpp0vJ4_VbmyNwJifrw#LampShadeForCV-V2

Here is the render:
https://www.icloud.com/iclouddrive/055_8Ykq1W9CL10R9QkZKL7sA#TiffanyLampShadeDraft-Mar23

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

I have no access to your files.

If you approach is working for you, fantastic!

My best wishes

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Ok. Sorry. Not sure what's going on. In the future, I will use a different method. However, it would be great if the forum allowed larger files to be included in the messages, as, for example, in the Redshift forums. This would make CV forum so much more usable!..

As always, thanks for all your efforts!!

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the reply. I have an iCloud account, and typically, that works.

Larger files were discussed repeatedly over the years and obviously will not happen. Sorry to have no better reply to this.

I have used it for uploads in the previous fora my DropBox account, only to see that some people upload up to one GB for a simple question.
Companies do not test larger zip files, so I feel weird about those.
However, my DropBox is the free personal version and available (AFAIK) with 2GB of space. Besides that, Google, Adobe, and Wetransfer offer something usable.
I mention those as I do not touch private or unknown cloud stuff.

Again, sorry about all of that, as it would be better to have a pleasant exchange option, safe and fast for everyone, I agree.

Cheers

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Here they are on DropBox. Let's see if this works.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dbri4zjj76xxb1x/LampShadeForCV-V2.c4d?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u24e0cfygvwj180/TiffanyLampShadeDraft-Mar23.exr?dl=0

I believe I have set the correct permissions.

Please let me know if you can download them.

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Thanks, Greg. Very kind of you to put some extra effort into this.

Nice that you found a solution. I have obviously not understood what you needed.
The terms Normal and Parallel provided me with the wrong "internal visuals".
If we run into that again, perhaps a sketch might support finding a solution.
https://stcineversityprod02.blob.core.windows.net/$web/Cineversity_Forum_Support/2023_PROJECTS_DRS/20230317_CV4_2023_drs_23_MGvl_01.c4d.zip

Enjoy your weekend

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Ah, very nice. I can now see how I might put a design, say, a flower, into the fracture. Draw the design with a spline, smooth, subdivide a bit possibly, and place appropriately!

As always thanks for your effort!!

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Thanks for the feedback, Greg.

I assume you know the mechanics of Voronoi. Writing in a forum makes me want to share needed information with everyone. Sometimes that is seen as an evaluation of the one asking, which is not the case at all.

When one designs shapes, no point lives alone. A pair always creates a line in the middle distance each other. At the moment, another pair is closer to the new line taking over. As a result, the Voronoi pattern is created.
This relationship is a bit challenging to design and requires some practice.

Enjoy your weekend

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Continuing this discussion...

I am having fun using a 0-dimension helix in a Cloner to create points for the VF. Nice patterns.

I had tried using many 0-dimension helices and arranging them by hand in an attempt to form a patterns of pieces that resembled a flower. However, looking at many stained-glass flowers I believe that a VF is insufficient to produce the patterns necessary.

My question is: Is there a way to draw a pattern with a spline on a plane then split the plane along the path of the spline?

My first guess at a technique would be to draw the pattern with a spline then use a sweep to create geometry along the path then a Boolean object to subtract the path geometry from the plane.

Any other ideas?

Thanks,
Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

To a certain degree, you can project Splines and use those as "Knife".
Project
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2023/en-us/Default.htm#html/TOOLSPLINEPROJECT.html#PLUGIN_CMD_450000046
Knife
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2023/en-us/Default.htm#html/TOOLKNIFELINE.html

The problem that I see is that those objects are created from flat glass pieces, not from a half bowl, for example.
With that, one would need to cut the shapes, then find how they fit together, which is one of the elegant parts of Tiffany lamps, especially with more curved shapes.
If we can exclude this challenge for a moment, the Project and Knife Workflow allows also the Thicken Generator to work (New in 2023-2)

https://stcineversityprod02.blob.core.windows.net/$web/Cineversity_Forum_Support/2023_PROJECTS_DRS/20230403_CV4_2023_drs_23_MOtl_01.c4d.zip

As a side note, there is Flatten option in the Mesh Menu.
https://help.maxon.net/c4d/2023/en-us/Default.htm#html/TOOLFLATTEN.html#PLUGIN_CMD_1058447

All the best

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Here is where I've ended up.

I tried all your suggestions but they didn't work well for me. I ended up liking the Sweep/Boolean approach.

Here's the workflow:

Import a ref image to front view
Create a plane with a good num of subdivs
Snap to poly = on
Draw splines for the lead between glass pieces
Sweep a circle along the splines, make sure all splines and resulting geometry overlap nicely
VBuild, VMesh, CStO, Connect and Delete
Boolean Plane and Lead so plane has separation between the glass pieces
CStO on Boolean
Thicken plane appropriately
Fiddle with materials

Here's a c4d file to show this. (should include textures)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yam63oepnjvoo50/ForCV-AP52-Apr23.c4d?dl=0

I'll have to redo I think making the space between the glass pieces narrower than the appropriate width of the final lead as the displacement causes artifacts around the edges of the glass. I the above scene I inflated the lead to remove most of the artifacts but the lead is too wide for my liking.

Finally, since the glass pieces are all individual objects I can do, I think, the following.

Create a shape for the lamp shade
Use Shrink Wrap to wrap the lead to the shape
Use Place Tool to place the glass pieces where appropriate
I'll have to make sure the size of the glass pieces and the curvature of the shape are such that the piece can nestle nicely into the surrounding lead.

Any comments appreciated!

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the file.

The Splines will only cut where they are. To have gaps in those will not work.

My example was a single glass piece. Having all these splines at once will work, but ensure the Knife> Split option is enabled. After that, the Tools> Convert> Polygon Islands to Objects.
Again, if the cut does not go through completely, it will not split.
My suggestion, use a plane and create a few splines to see the "logic" of this workflow.

Also, explore if a tight mesh is the best idea, as some splines might be very close to an existing edge, which might result in weird artifacts. I do not give here a fixed suggestion, as this is not a general workflow with defined parts.

If you use closed Splines, one for each glass piece, while projected to the surface, those can support the selection if you like to keep one object.

https://stcineversityprod02.blob.core.windows.net/$web/Cineversity_Forum_Support/2023_PROJECTS_DRS/20230405_CV4_2023_drs_23_MOtf_01.c4d.zip

Cheers

[Dr. Sassi]

Here is a quick screen capture:

https://stcineversityprod02.blob.core.windows.net/$web/Cineversity_Forum_Support/2023_Clips_DRS/Tiffany4D.mp4

Please download it, if you like to see it in a better quality.

File, with Remesher, as suggested, below.
CV4_2023_drs_23_MOtf_12.c4d

Enjoy

[GregBollella]

@Dr-Sassi Nice. About the same as I did but I used VB and VM on the 'lead' then Remesh.

Here's the image with my effort.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/b4ps6p3qm83tidn/AbstractPastels51CC-Mar23_1.1.1.png?dl=0

On yours put a RS Object tag on the pieces and lead and some displacement on the materials. Use a glass material for the pieces. Check how the edges of the pieces look. With enough displacement to give the glass that wavy look the edges of the pieces get artifacts. The lead has to be pretty wide to cover them up.

Greg

[Dr. Sassi]

You're welcome, GegBollela.

It looks like you found your workflow. Yes, Remesher is a good idea. I will add the file to the screen capture. It works with Split and Thicken, while the Fracture can provide even colors.

Enjoy your weekend.